Южнославянские E-V13

[Sergey Lutak]

Везет Вам, E1b1b1, на харизматичных деятелей.

Точнее, на мудаков с сомнительной кровавой репутацией.
Гитлер (без комментариев), Линдон Джонсон (инициатор войны во Вьетнаме и доктрины Джонсона), Джон Кэлхун (главный идеолог рабовладельческого строя в США) - упоминания о них надо выпилить к чёртовой матери из нашего списка

Это, брат, история. 
И относится к ним надо тоже как к истории. Не больше, не меньше!

[ninodjukic]

Here is comparison between Bojovic's and my haplotypes - only 1 difference in 34 common markers:

   393   390   394   391   385a   385b   426   388   439   389-1   392   389-2   458   459a   459b   455   454   447   437   448   449   464a   464b   464c   464d   460   gatah4   ycaiia   ycaiib   456   442   438   444   446
   
Djukic   13   24   13   10   16   18   11   12   11   14   11   31   15   9   9   11   11   26   14   20   32   14   16   17   17   9   10   19   21   17   11   10   12   12
Bojovic   13   25   13   10   16   18   11   12   11   14   11   31   15   9   9   11   11   26   14   20   32   14   16   17   17   9   10   19   21   17   11   10   12   12   

Using McGee's utility, I came up with this assuming 32 years per generation, and McDonald's mutation rate of 0.0005.0.01:
- With 95% certainty, TMRCA is 1,024 years.
- With 50% certainty, TMRCA is 352 years.

According to family tradition, the TMRCA should be around 420 years (common ancestor born around 1550).

Comments?

[Sergey Lutak]

Nino, you have only one mutation at 34 markers and according to your family tradition your common ancestor born around 1550!
It's great!

Unfortunately you have non-standard set of common markers (not 25 or 37). I don't know average mutation rate per generation per marker for your 34-marker set. Therefore, my estimates are very-very approximate, moreover that the calculation of TMRCA on the basis of only two haplotypes are incorrect. And yet, I will risk. 

I'll take the average mutation rate per generation for FTDNA-standard 25-marker haplotype - 0.00184 per marker.
You have 1 mutation at 68 (34 plus 34) common markers:
1/68/0.00184=8 generations! It appears that your common ancestor could lived later than in 16th-17th centuries. Your common ancestor could lived in the 18th century! 

Nino, I do not insist on anything. This is only my opinion, only my comment and it may be mistaken. 

I would like to hear the opinion of our experts, especially the view of Vadim Urasin (wertner).

[wertner]

Sorry, but now I don't know how to calculate TRMCA.

[Sergey Lutak]

Sorry, but now I don't know how to calculate TRMCA.

Вадим, а на какой ветви наши черногорские братья? Можешь показать, кто их ближайшие соседи на древе E1b1b1a1b-V13?

[ninodjukic]

Does it also help to see the DYS values of markers that are NOT common to both of us?

Here is my haplotype:
http://postimage.org/image/31x77824k/


Here is Bojovic's haplotype:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/8/shaplotype.png

[ninodjukic]

I was just confirmed as E1b1b1a2 via Deep Clade testing.

V13+ (confirmed)
L142.1+, V36+ (presumed)
V27-, P65-, L17-, L143-, M35.2- (confirmed)

Which additional SNPs does it make sense to test  at this point?

Thanks,

Nino

[Sergey Lutak]

I was just confirmed as E1b1b1a2 via Deep Clade testing.

V13+ (confirmed)
L142.1+, V36+ (presumed)
V27-, P65-, L17-, L143-, M35.2- (confirmed)

Which additional SNPs does it make sense to test  at this point?

Thanks,

Nino

Nino, you are E1b1b1a1b* (V13+, V36+, L142.1+) in new nomenclature of ISOGG from 10 July 2011 like Me: http://www.isogg.org/tree/ISOGG_HapgrpE.html
Here are my SNPs: V36+ V13+ M78+ L544+ L542+ L539+ L142.1+ V27- V22- V12- P65- L99- L250- L241- L17- L143-

But perhaps even this: E1b1b1a1b8 (L540)

[Sergey Lutak]

...
But perhaps even this: E1b1b1a1b8 (L540)

SNP L540 $29.00 in FTDNA.
Unfortunately, I do not have any information about this SNP. 

[ninodjukic]

Thanks, Sergey.

Wow, it already changed (FTDNA still uses E1b1b1a2 nomenclature)!

So, since I'm presumed to be L142.1+ and V36+, do I need to test for them?

Or, do I only test the remaining SNPs that could fall under this clade:
•      •       •      •       •      •       •      •       •       E1b1b1a1b7   L250, L251, L252
•      •       •      •       •      •       •      •       •       E1b1b1a1b8   L540
 
So, I test 2 + 4 SNPs = about $150?

What about the ones you mentioned - L544, L542, L539 - where do they fall under the clade - is there a nomenclature for them?

[Sergey Lutak]

Nino, I think that you don't need to test for L142.1 and V36, because they are almost similar to V13. You are presumed to be L142.1+ and V36+.

You can to test only 3 SNPs: L241, L250 (L251 and L252 no need to test) and L540.
But the probability of a positive result is extremely low, because of your cousins ​​in the range of 10 mutations at 37 markers there are no L241+, L250+ and L540+. These clusters are small and relatively young - not more than 2,000 years.

It's my humble opinion, but maybe I'll order myself test for L540

[Sergey Lutak]

...
What about the ones you mentioned - L544, L542, L539 - where do they fall under the clade - is there a nomenclature for them?

These SNPs were ordered by Peter Gwozdz for me and for a few other participants.
Peter thinks that L544, L542, L539 are located somewhere between E1b1b1a1 (M78) and E1b1b1a1b (V13).

[ninodjukic]

Thanks, Sergey.

I'll then order 6 SNPs - L241, L250, L539, L540, L542, L544.

Nino

[Sergey Lutak]

Thanks, Sergey.

I'll then order 6 SNPs - L241, L250, L539, L540, L542, L544.

Nino

Hi, Nino!
Yesterday I ordered a test for L540 in FTDNA.
I think that you don't need to test for L539, L542, L544. The exact location for these SNPs on the Y-tree is still unknown.

[Sergey Lutak]

Thanks, Sergey.

I'll then order 6 SNPs - L241, L250, L539, L540, L542, L544.

Nino

Hi, Nino!
Yesterday I ordered a test for L540 in FTDNA.
I think that you don't need to test for L539, L542, L544. The exact location for these SNPs on the Y-tree is still unknown.

I received new results from FTDNA.
I am L540-